Prop2 information request; wiring/programming?

[JonnyMac]

Frank,

Most of our customers have far less experience than you -- and that's okay.  We made a deliberate decision to provide the level of service that we do because most people don't in fact know what we know (they just haven't learned yet), but still want the outcome that they get with the controller.

I'm sorry if my feature creep comment sounded like a criticism; that was not my intention.  What I thought was happening is that you were discovering that you could do more than you intended and adding in.   This is okay... until we get to the point when the controller can no longer support a particular feature.  Sometimes customers are disappointed to get a "no" after so many "yes" answers; this is why I encourage stating all possible goals up front so that we can figure out what is and isn't possible, then design the system to accommodate everything.  Luckily, the changes you made along the way were minuscule and had no real impact on the design.  In my professional life, though, I have seen feature creep wreck development schedules and delay important products.

One of our goals is to encourage customers to play.  Since you have a good understanding of electronics principals it's not likely that you'd do anything to harm the controller.   Let me suggest that when you get this project done (BTW, both John B and I are guitar players) that you sit down and go through our basic training document for the Prop-2; it will be fun and I'm sure you'll start to see even more possibilities.

[Friz]

Haha Jon,

Yes, I must admit ~ seeing the possibilities of a controller (Prop 2) in my Tube amp project really placed wind back in the sails...
Far too long have i visited web links where controllers are available but support was non-existing.

When i emailed EFX-TEK and received an immediate response along with your myriad of knowledge (Hardware & Software) I was stunned. :o
Yes, it would only be normal after receiving the latter to place the cart before the horse!  :D

I am sorry for the way it unfolded, i never intended to continually appear to add features.
Last week i reviewed the Prop 2 training document but simply reading the document is not enough, your desire for me to actual "play" while using the document is the best method for gaining an understanding; i agree totally!

Thank you,

Frank  :)

[Friz]

Hi JonnyMac,

Information provided via Prop 2 controller Documentation concerning I/O setup jumpers P12-P15 outlied below:

I/O pins P12..P15 have additional configuration (SETUP) jumpers that allow either of these pins to be set to a
predetermined state when used as an input.
When the jumper is placed in the "UP" position, the pin is pulled up to Vdd (+5v) through a 4.7 kW resistor
this is the setting to use for active-low trigger devices or configurations (i.e., a normally open switch placed between the trigger pin and Vss).

When the jumper is placed in the "DN" position, the pin is pulled down to Vss (ground) through a 4.7 kW resistor;
this is the setting to use for active-high trigger devices or configurations (i.e., the output from a PIR or sonic sensor).
Use of the SETUP jumper is optional, but should be used when either of these pins is used as an input as
a "floating" input pin can cause false triggering.

Note that if not needed as inputs, P12..P15 may be used as outputs (remove SETUP jumper when using either as an output).

My project has made this section a little confusing, I am uncertain as to the configuration of setup jumpers P12-P15.

Please, provide what you would determine to be the best jumper settings for my application/project.

Thank you,

Frank 

[JonnyMac]

You'll see in the second listing that I specified the SETUP jumpers as either "removed" or "DN" -- your call on which to do (keeping them on the board makes the less likely to wander off...).  Technically, the ULN output driver acts as a pull-down on the IO pins, so placing a SETUP jump in the DN position has no affect on circuit operation.

That the ULN acts as a pull-down is what allows us to use P0 - P7 as active-high inputs; the only way to make those pins "float" (which would require an external pull-up or pull-down) is to remove the ULN -- so don't!  ;)

[Friz]

Hi JonnyMac,

Using your advice i will place the Setup jumpers in the "DN" position to start.
After a day of testing the arrangement ~ if i note some obscure condition i will remove jumpers and try again...

I agree with your view in reference to the ULN output but the only true way to know is through experimenting.

Thank you for the fast response.  :)

Frank

[JonnyMac]

I'm a very big fan of experimenting.  ;D

[Friz]

Hi JonnyMac,

Viewing the specifications of the Prop2 controller i have been unable to determine the current consumption.

Switching supplies usually generate more ripple/noise than a conventional transformer supply, around audio circuits the latter can be
a problem.
I plan to try the supplied supply provided with the starter kit but would also like to know the typical current consumption of the Prop2 controller, without any relays (as noted in project) connected; stand alone Prop2 controller only.

An approximate current value is more than enough etc...


Thank you,

Frank  :)

[JonnyMac]

According to information on page 5 of the Prop-2 documentation... ;), the no-loads current of the Prop-2 is 25 mA.

http://www.efx-tek.com/downloads/prop-2_docs.pdf

[Friz]

Yes, i read the amount but was unsure since the value provided may be idle current.

I would think when activity is being performed the current would increase etc...
(activity internal to the controller; non-external devices etc...)
However, since i am relatively new to this aspect of electronics i could easily be wrong.

Thank you,  :)

Frank

[JonnyMac]

You're over-thinking things, Frank.  Yes, there is a [tiny] bit of difference between a controller running and not, but our spec is based on a program running -- an idle controller doesn't do anything so that spec is not really useful.

We publish a [conservative] specification that you can trust.  Let me prove it: I happen to have power supply with a handy tap point for measuring current.  Here's what I get with NO LOADS:

Power = P1 (power LED only)
-- program running = 19.3 mA (the 25 mA spec -- conservative [we added 25%] -- is based on this)
-- program at END = 16.5 mA

Power = P2 (power and V+ LEDs lit)
-- program running = 27.9 mA
-- program at END = 25.2 mA

[Friz]

Hi JonnyMac,

Amazing, extremely low current controller (Prop2)! :o

Being around tube circuits for a long time has caused me to question low current devices...
Sadly, the latter is due to being on "trailing edge technology" for far too long... ;D

Thank you for the measurements and enlightenment!  :)

Frank

[Friz]

Hi JonnyMac,

Quick question...

The N.O tactile switches as depicted on your drawing are each connected to the W & R Prop2 terminals (header).
Would i need to use two wires for each tactile switch?

-or-

Could i tie one side of all the tactile switches together and route one return wire to the R (Prop2 terminal)?

Additionally, the majorty of LEDs connect between the W & B Prop2 terminals (header).
Are both wires per LED each required or can i simply connect all cathods together and route one wire to the B terminal; with the exception of the Clean/lead since it requires a different configuration because of the dual (LEDs).

Link included to show connections, please review (especially the Clean/Lead LED wiring); G3 = bypass for short...
The LED for the power ON is provided at another location etc...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y109/emperor500/Controlpanelschematic_dwg.jpg

I would like to reduce the amount of wire if possible.
However, if the latter would cause a problem please advise.

Thank you,

Frank   :)

[JonnyMac]

Yes, you can tie one Px.R pin (+5v) to one side of all buttons, then route the other side back to the individual Px.W pins.

[Friz]

Hi JonnyMac,

Wow!

I never expected an answer/reply this late; 1AM EST.  :o

Thank you for the help!   :)

[Friz]

Quote:

Your LEDs (this is new) will connect to P8 (channel 1) and P13 (channel 6).
There's already a 220-ohm resistor on the board so you can keep use a 220 or keep your 470 -- either will work fine.  Connect like this:

Hi JonnyMac,

I checked the Prop2 and measured the series resistors at 100 ohm (8 each directly in front of the W pins); 16 total.
The value is printed on the surface mount resistor = 101

Please, check to make sure the above is the correct value.
Hopefully, i am viewing the same location as you previously noted.

Additionally, i realize if the value you stated (240ohm) is incorrect, I generally forget about TTL 5VDC levels and immediately use 12VDC in many calculations.

Thank you,

Frank    :)